sick tosai

Emergency aid for sick fish and sick ponds.
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Marilyn
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Re: sick tosai

Postby Marilyn » April 17th, 2017, 5:11 pm

No need for pics. Ulcers are often a byproduct of a parasite breaking through the slime coat.

Yes, s/s. Also check the gills. If the gills look okay then I suspect flukes but definitely confirm with a s/s. Elbagin is a very mild product and does nothing for parasites. Also, as you mentioned, it isn't nearly as effective unless you do the other things like salt to .3 and heating to over 72 degrees. If there is a big difference between your water temp and 72, raise the temp incrementally.
Topically treat the ulcers. Locate the cause of them.

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Russell Peters
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Re: sick tosai

Postby Russell Peters » April 17th, 2017, 5:16 pm

Flukes tend to be the number one reason for ulcers, other than bacterial issues, so I would scrape them and probably treat all of your fish.
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Re: sick tosai

Postby Russell Peters » April 17th, 2017, 5:24 pm

kevin32 wrote:
Russell Peters wrote:Flukes tend to be the number one reason for ulcers, other than bacterial issues, so I would scrape them and probably treat all of your fish.


thanks russ. are you home now?


No, I am at Starbucks in Isawa Japan waiting to go Koi hunting again for one more day.
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Re: sick tosai

Postby Russell Peters » April 17th, 2017, 5:25 pm

kevin32 wrote:and if I find flukes what is the treatment for tosai? I did expose this fish to some nitrite spikes. I've never had tosai and might be a bit in over my head. seems I learn the hard way or aka wrong way.


Flukes would be Prazi or Fenbendazole. We have Fenbendazole as it works better than Prazi. Nitrites can cause issues with Koi like this too. S&S and see what you have.
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Graybird
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Re: sick tosai

Postby Graybird » April 17th, 2017, 6:05 pm

It's a skill that is MUCH better learned through a friend than from a book. What is your temp in the tank with nitrite? I had a bear of a time trying to break through the nitrite spike until I was advised to raise the temp. 72 or above will do the trick. You are salting for it, yes?

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Marilyn
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Re: sick tosai

Postby Marilyn » April 17th, 2017, 6:58 pm

Kevin, you say you can get ammonia down easy but I suspect you mean you bind it. That really isn't addressing the issue, it's just protecting the koi and making them more comfortable. You've got to sort out the nitrite issue. Period. You're getting the nitrites because of the ammonia and the overall inability of the system to keep up with what you're trying to do.
Don't feed, get the water under control. It's important. When koi reside in perpetual water issues it weakens their immune systems and you're setting yourself up for failure.
So I know it's expensive but you've got to get the tank to cycle and as Mary said, and I said earlier, 72 is usually the magic number for that. You've overstocked and this will help the system handle what you're asking it to do.

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Re: sick tosai

Postby Russell Peters » April 17th, 2017, 7:49 pm

Stop putting Koi in your tank and finish your pond. You have done nothing to mitigate your issues. You just keep making them worse. We can only advise you so much before you just do what is right
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Re: sick tosai

Postby Russell Peters » April 18th, 2017, 5:58 am

kevin32 wrote:
Marilyn wrote:Kevin, you say you can get ammonia down easy but I suspect you mean you bind it. That really isn't addressing the issue, it's just protecting the koi and making them more comfortable. You've got to sort out the nitrite issue. Period. You're getting the nitrites because of the ammonia and the overall inability of the system to keep up with what you're trying to do.
Don't feed, get the water under control. It's important. When koi reside in perpetual water issues it weakens their immune systems and you're setting yourself up for failure.
So I know it's expensive but you've got to get the tank to cycle and as Mary said, and I said earlier, 72 is usually the magic number for that. You've overstocked and this will help the system handle what you're asking it to do.


my ammonia always seemed to clear no binder pretty fast . nitrites have always been a problem and my nitrates were always high. I finally added a shower to the one tank and need to test nitrates tomorrow.

we had warm weather so I unplugged the heaters. it got cold again and I should have plugged the money pits back in lol.

tosai seem to beg for food. I will feed wheat germ and lighten the feeding. I can see where these tosai are heading...


You should not unplug the heaters for your Tosai, they are more fragile, when it warms up they will turn off by them selves if you have a thermostat on them and then, if to does get colder, they will turn back on. It is best for Tosai to keep them warm this time of year. I never turn off my heater.
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Marilyn
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Re: sick tosai

Postby Marilyn » April 18th, 2017, 8:01 am

I don't know of any local resources for slides, I've never needed them.

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Graybird
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Re: sick tosai

Postby Graybird » April 18th, 2017, 9:22 am

Google lab supplies or microscope supplies and your town, there are at least a couple of places near you. They are properly called "cover slips," btw. You want plastic, don't get glass.


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